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Old 10-28-2011, 05:31 PM
NextGen1967 NextGen1967 is offline
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 57
Quote:
If you're good at reading between the lines and merging it with what has been said then you'll understand Chuck's post. There's been talk of four different layers put onto Mg; ZnO, MgO, Mg(OH)2 and Cl. Seeing that Cl has been discussed as a CO2 converter and that HCL acid can heat and strip Mg oxides in a flash and bond with Mg to form a MgCL layer, it would be deduced that this is the process Chuck is talking about for use in their CO2 producing carbonate cells.

Ron's cells are very interesting too, seeing current can be produced with the touching of the coated electrodes. I agree with both ron and JB regarding the toughness of getting the layering of the Cu to stick. In my tests, the CuO wants to "pop" off when the Cu+Cu2O cools after heating. I agree that using a binder or evaporation method would be an easier way to ensure its placement.

I posted the MR cell to help understand what he was doing, not the JB's carbonate cell. It's a starting point. After reading MR's papers, there is a great deal of resonant balancing that he does between electromagnetic and mechanical properties, along with resistance balancing, electron training and plate design. I now agree with JB that making a MR cell would be like patting your head, rubbing your belly, while riding a unicycle on a tight rope. But, it can be done...

rw
Yes, seems correct :-)

These methods by the way (often in dual mode) can be done in pure chemical way as well in call it electrochemical way (zap it with current, to 'bake' the layer). Jim has some very good video's on his Youtube channel about this.

Tough it are not my cells that produce current but Jim's ones (the ZnO type). My ones are good in high voltage, but low amperage.. I got some 10 to 12uA, using a 20mm or so ribbon length.

Jim get slightly less voltage, but *much* more amperage, while using tiny electrodes.... with Zero water and electrolyte mix. To me this indicates some importance.

About the CuO... The website given earlier on how to do this best does a good job... I followed that way (minus the removing of the black layer of course), and got a 95% success rate on developing the black layer.. you can rub and tap it and it won't come off, it also doesn't crack anymore. the 5% failure rate is due to droplet spots (some 55 tiny of them), which show the reddish layer below. Next time I can avoid this error probably.

An interesting note: I used the same copper plate as before, but have cleaned it really thoroughly, and after scrubbing and washing, used the muriatic acid to get the copper clean to the bone. The side of the copper that i had previously used with a binder reached an success rate of nearly 100%... It has some 8 dots on it where the black layer is less thin, but nonetheless the layer is still there.

One thing that skips the mind easy is that after the layers has been made, on both electrodes, other mixes could serve as 'electrolyte'... One only need to stay within the borders of not using mixes that are to aggressive on the created layers.

I am lacking the ability to get powders/solutions etc. here in a timely manner, as -don't laugh- it takes me here between 21 to 90 days before a product reach me... so I will always walk somewhat behind hehe. It's just me being located in a part of the world that is not so advanced.... Got used to the slowness here tough.

I do really not know anything much about the MR cell (just recently when I came aware of this threat) I heard the term MR repeated over and over again, but I personally think it isn't that hard -have to stay positive- right :-)

It might be that once one opens an MR cell (which I assume is sealed airtight ?) *something* leaves the mix, so it cannot be analyzed anymore, unless you realized it must have been there in the first place... Something with about twice the mass of water, and which mimics its working. I forgot the name of it... its a long time ago I knew about it. Tough this is speculation on my part, since I never had an opportunity to order some of this product and play with its properties.

Jim's cell however gives -to me- much more confidence at the moment, due to the said high current production... I have so far no one seen done this, except JB with a huge glass like cell. I do NOT say to disregard chucks/JB's cells at all! let me make that clear. However 2 semiconductors touching each other with no fluids or mix in between producing current is as said unique to me. I have done this long before (with JB's copper oxide layers), but this had at that time involved heat to get the layers in conductive mode.

One more thing. I think it was chuck? who found out some very important aspect of the magnesium metal..... BEFORE applying (any type) of 'correct' layer on it, the old one that might be there has to be removed... this is extremely important since a minute tiny defect in the 'correct' layer would otherwise result in a *very* rapid deterioration of the layer due to the 'old' layer below it will cause the 'correct' layer to rapidly detach.

I per accident destroyed my 'correct' layer, and in my rush to create another one, I was to eager and rushing and due to that I got a very bad result.. It did look like perfect and it worked like perfect (well slightly less performance then i had before), but after a good inspection with some 200 probing spots, I found many tiny defects where the layer was less then optimal in resistance... Lesson, be sure to work correct and do not shortcut.

--
Ron.
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